Legislature(2013 - 2014)BUTROVICH 205

02/12/2013 03:30 PM Senate COMMUNITY & REGIONAL AFFAIRS


Download Mp3. <- Right click and save file as

Audio Topic
03:32:01 PM Start
03:32:50 PM SB32
04:19:00 PM Adjourn
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
Bills Previously Heard/Scheduled
+= SB 32 CHIKUMINUK LAKE HYDROELECTRIC SITE TELECONFERENCED
Moved CSSB 32(CRA) Out of Committee
           SB  32-CHIKUMINUK LAKE HYDROELECTRIC SITE                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
3:32:50 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR MICCICHE announced SB 32 to be up for consideration.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
3:33:18 PM                                                                                                                    
BRETT HUBER, staff to Senator McGuire, sponsor of SB 32, said                                                                   
Senator McGuire sent her apologies for not being able to be                                                                     
here, and that he was available to answer questions.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
3:33:55 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR EGAN joined the meeting.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
3:34:09 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR BISHOP moved Amendment 1.                                                                                               
                                                 28-LS0311\A.2                                                                  
                                                      Bullock                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
                          AMENDMENT 1                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
     OFFERED IN THE SENATE                                                                                                      
     TO:  SB 32                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
     Page 1, line 1, following "that":                                                                                        
          Insert "a feasibility study for"                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Page 1, line 2, following "Park":                                                                                        
          Insert "; relating to the Wood-Tikchik State Park                                                                   
     management plan and the amendment  of the plan to allow                                                                  
     for  a  feasibility  study   for  the  development  and                                                                  
     operation of  a hydroelectric site at  Chikuminuk Lake;                                                                  
     relating to the enforcement  of provisions in the Wood-                                                                  
     Tikchik  State  Park  management plan  and  regulations                                                                  
     relating  to  the  Wood-Tikchik  State  Park  that  are                                                                  
     inconsistent   with  a   feasibility   study  for   the                                                                  
     development and  operation of  a hydroelectric  site at                                                                  
     Chikuminuk Lake; and providing for an effective date"                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Page 1, lines 4 - 6:                                                                                                       
          Delete all material and insert:                                                                                       
        "* Section  1. AS 41.21.167 is  amended by  adding a                                                                
     new subsection to read:                                                                                                    
          (e)  Performance of a feasibility study for the                                                                       
     development and  operation of  a hydroelectric  site at                                                                    
     Chikuminuk Lake is not considered an incompatible use.                                                                     
        * Sec. 2. The uncodified  law of the State of Alaska                                                                  
     is amended by adding a new section to read:                                                                                
          TRANSITION: WOOD-TIKCHIK STATE PARK MANAGEMENT                                                                        
     PLAN  AND  REGULATIONS;  ENFORCEMENT. To  allow  for  a                                                                    
     feasibility study for the  development and operation of                                                                    
     a   hydroelectric   site   at  Chikuminuk   Lake,   the                                                                    
     Department of Natural Resources                                                                                            
               (1)  shall amend the Wood-Tikchik State Park                                                                     
     Management  Plan, dated  October 2002, and  regulations                                                                    
     applicable to  the Wood-Tikchik  State Park  to conform                                                                    
     to AS 41.21.167(e), enacted by sec. 1 of this Act; and                                                                     
               (2)  may not enforce or implement provisions                                                                     
     in the  Wood-Tikchik State Park Management  Plan, dated                                                                    
     October 2002, and  regulations applicable to  the Wood-                                                                    
     Tikchik   State  Park   that   are  inconsistent   with                                                                    
     AS 41.21.167(e), enacted by sec. 1 of this Act.                                                                            
       * Sec. 3. This Act takes effect immediately under                                                                      
     AS 01.10.070(c)."                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR BISHOP asked Mr. Huber  to walk the committee through the                                                               
amendment.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
MR. HUBER said Amendment 1  was prepared in consultation with the                                                               
Division  of Parks,  Department  of Natural  Resources (DNR)  and                                                               
drafted by Legislative  Legal. The effect of the  amendment is to                                                               
make clear  that the activity  authorized by this act  is limited                                                               
to the  performance of  a feasibility  study for  the development                                                               
and  operation  of  a  hydroelectric  site  at  Chikuminuk  Lake.                                                               
Instead   of  adding   Chikuminuk  Lake   to  the   list  in   AS                                                               
41.27.167(c),  language  in  the  original  bill,  the  amendment                                                               
deletes  section 1  and replaces  it with  a new  section 1  that                                                               
creates a new subsection (e) that states:                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
        (e)  Performance of a feasibility study for the                                                                         
      development and operation of a hydroelectric site at                                                                      
     Chikuminuk Lake is not considered an incompatible use.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
In  addition,  the  amendment  adds a  section  2  that  provides                                                               
transitional language the  effect of which is in  (1) require the                                                               
amendment  of the  Park Management  Plan  to conform  to the  new                                                               
subsection. Section  2 also disallows enforcement  of the current                                                               
plan  as it  applies to  the new  provision. It  makes conforming                                                               
changes to the title of the bill.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
MR. HUBER said  this amendment was consistent  with the sponsor's                                                               
intent  in offering  the  original bill,  which  is allowing  the                                                               
study Nuvista is conducting to continue.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
He said  Senator McGuire  supports providing  energy alternatives                                                               
across  the state  and for  each region  to have  the ability  to                                                               
assess and  makes its  own decisions  and this  further clarifies                                                               
that intent.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
3:36:19 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR  EGAN asked  if  the  fiscal note  had  changed with  the                                                               
amendment.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
MR. HUBER answered there is a  $20,000 fiscal note, but it hadn't                                                               
changed.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR MICCICHE  clarified that some  people around the  park were                                                               
worried that the earlier bill was too broad.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. HUBER  responded that the original  bill added a lake  to the                                                               
list  of lakes  already authorized  in the  not incompatible  use                                                               
section, but  after testimony they  thought it was wise  to stick                                                               
with their original  intent, which was to provide  for that study                                                               
to go forward.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
3:37:25 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR GIESSEL  asked if he  had talked  with Nuvista or  any of                                                               
the residents who testified to  see if they were comfortable with                                                               
this amendment.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
MR. HUBER  answered that  they had  talked to  a number  of folks                                                               
including Nuvista and  Calista that are working on  the study and                                                               
they are comfortable with the amendment.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
3:39:09 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR  MICCICHE asked  for a  roll call  vote; Senators  Giessel,                                                               
Egan,  Bishop and  Micciche voted  yea; and  there were  no nays.                                                               
Therefore, Amendment 1 was adopted.                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
3:39:18 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR MICCICHE opened public testimony on the CSSB 32(CRA).                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
3:39:39 PM                                                                                                                    
MAX ANGELLAN,  representing himself, Kwethluk,  Alaska, supported                                                               
SB  32, saying  he thought  a hydroelectric  project would  bring                                                               
down their high electric, gas and  fuel prices. They pay $.52 per                                                               
kilowatt hour, $10.50 for a gallon  of gas and $6.91 for a gallon                                                               
of heating fuel.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
3:43:10 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR MICCICHE thanked  him for his testimony,  but pointed out                                                               
that  this  bill only  authorizes  a  feasibility study  for  the                                                               
development and operation of a site.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
3:43:30 PM                                                                                                                    
ELAINE  BROWN,   Nuvista  Light  &  Electric,   Nuvista,  Alaska,                                                               
supported the amendment to SB 32  so they can continue with their                                                               
feasibility studies over the next few years.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
3:44:19 PM                                                                                                                    
GEORGE  GUY,  Chairman,  Nuvista Light  &  Electric  Cooperative,                                                               
Inc.,  Kwethluk supported  SB 32  with Amendment  1. He  said the                                                               
high  cost of  energy causes  many people,  some of  whom are  on                                                               
fixed incomes, to choose between  buying food or heating fuel. He                                                               
said they are still living in  the 19th century, but 21st Century                                                               
structures  are available  to improve  their living  standards as                                                               
citizens of the United States of America.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
3:47:32 PM                                                                                                                    
ANDREW GUY, President and CEO,  Calista Corporation, supported SB
32. He  said the cost  of energy  and transportation are  the big                                                               
factors  driving businesses  out there  or the  lack of.  He said                                                               
it's  harder to  establish businesses  in the  Bush because  they                                                               
have to  compete with urban  businesses that have the  benefit of                                                               
energy projects that  have been paid for by the  state as well as                                                               
economies  of  scale.  The  businesses in  rural  Alaska  do  not                                                               
benefit from the Power Cost Equalization Program.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
3:49:47 PM                                                                                                                    
JACOB  BLACK,  President,  Napakiak  Council,  Napakiak,  Alaska,                                                               
supported  SB 32,  because that  would mean  they could  go ahead                                                               
with the  project in the  summer of 2014.  He said their  cost of                                                               
living is really high.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
3:52:02 PM                                                                                                                    
JULIA ANDREW,  Acting Tribal Administrator, Village  of Napakiak,                                                               
Alaska, supported SB  32, because the fuel prices  in the village                                                               
are really  high. She said,  "A lot of  people are having  a hard                                                               
time in the village this winter."                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
3:53:28 PM                                                                                                                    
WILLY  KASAYULIE,   Chairman,  Calista  Corporation,   and  board                                                               
member, Nuvista  Light & Power Cooperative,  Inc., Bethel, Alaska                                                               
supported SB  32 and Amendment  1. He supported  earlier comments                                                               
about  the high  cost of  energy for  both fuel  and electricity,                                                               
which makes it expensive to keep schools operating.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
3:55:25 PM                                                                                                                    
LISA  ILUTSIK, representing  herself, Aleknagik,  Alaska, opposed                                                               
SB  32. She  said  that anyone  who has  ever  traveled to  Wood-                                                               
Tikchik State Park  would immediately recognize that  there is no                                                               
place like  it on earth; it  is a pristine and  remote wilderness                                                               
and it  needs to remain  protected from any sort  of development.                                                               
The astronomical  projected project costs are  not worth damaging                                                               
a lake  and river  system that  is home  to rich  salmon breeding                                                               
grounds and other lake species of fish.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
3:57:27 PM                                                                                                                    
ANDREW   ANGSTMAN,  representing   himself,  Anchorage,   Alaska,                                                               
opposed CSSB 32(CREA)  and said the feasibility  study was denied                                                               
by the  Division of  Parks and  Recreation for  specific reasons.                                                               
The activities  described by Nuvista include  seismic surveys and                                                               
helicopter work, which is banned  in Wood-Tikchik State Park, and                                                               
motor boat  operation on Chikuminuk  Lake, which is  also banned.                                                               
Writing a  law saying they can  do whatever they need  to do just                                                               
because  doesn't make  sense and  doesn't make  it right.  He was                                                               
really concerned about the validity  that this amended bill would                                                               
give  to the  entire  project.  He said  it  was noteworthy  that                                                               
people in support  of this bill overall are coming  from the side                                                               
of  the mountains  where the  water in  Chikuminuk Lake  does not                                                               
run;  they come  from the  Kuskokwim where  none of  the possible                                                               
environmental  impacts will  ever  take place  and  they will  be                                                               
getting all the power.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
3:59:48 PM                                                                                                                    
GRANT FAIRBANKS,  representing himself,  Bethel, Alaska,  said he                                                               
opposed  CSSB 32(CRA).  He said  it had  been 40  years since  he                                                               
received  a degree  in business  and economics,  but he  is still                                                               
well versed  in economics.  Since 1973 when  he moved  to Western                                                               
Alaska he had studied solar electricity  and had built one of the                                                               
first total  solar electric homes  in a  very remote area  of the                                                               
Kuskokwim  River and  at  a cost  of less  than  $15,000. He  was                                                               
certain that  every village  household in  the region  could have                                                               
total solar  electricity with grid-tied  backup for a  cost equal                                                               
to  that of  the proposed  Susitna  project per  home cost.  This                                                               
system  would have  a per-home  cost of  only 15  percent of  the                                                               
proposed Chikuminuk  hydroproject and  not jeopardize  the salmon                                                               
habitat of the Wood-Tikchik system.                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
A pilot solar or  wind project in a few villages  could be a good                                                               
test  for an  electric co-op  like Nuvista.  This type  of energy                                                               
would  employ  local  people  and   provide  great  benefits  for                                                               
everyone and at a fraction of the cost of hydroelectricity.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
He  said  there  is  a  reason our  country  is  dismantling  the                                                               
hydroelectric  dams on  salmon rivers;  they cause  many problems                                                               
for  downstream  salmon habitat.  This  river  drains into  three                                                               
lakes that  have major  salmon spawning  areas and  this proposed                                                               
dam  and  hydro  could  have  a very  negative  effect  on  their                                                               
habitat.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
4:02:19 PM                                                                                                                    
MICHAEL HOFFMAN, representing himself,  Bethel, Alaska opposed SB
32. He  had been born and  raised in the Kuskokwim  region and so                                                               
did his father and grandfather.  He said the Chikuminuk region is                                                               
one of the last true wilderness  areas in the State of Alaska and                                                               
even thinking about  putting a dam up when most  of the states in                                                               
the Lower 48 are tearing them  down doesn't make any sense and to                                                               
believe that  if this  dam is  built that  it would  provide much                                                               
needed energy  to a  region the  size of the  state of  Oregon is                                                               
unsupported  and misguided.  Supplying energy  to about  14 towns                                                               
this project  would not be an  economic project for the  state to                                                               
pay for. The  environmental impact would be  devastating not only                                                               
to  the depth  and the  temperature of  the water,  which have  a                                                               
negative effect on the sockeye  salmon spawning down below but on                                                               
the  moose and  caribou  that  people in  the  area  rely on  for                                                               
subsistence. He supported using more solar and wind energy.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
4:04:45 PM                                                                                                                    
ROBERT  BEANS,  Board  Member,  Calista  Corporation,  Anchorage,                                                               
Alaska, supported SB  32 from the standpoint of  quality of life.                                                               
He put  in eight years as  law enforcement in this  region and in                                                               
that time he  saw people without hope, and it  seems like it gets                                                               
more  so every  time. This  energy project  would give  them some                                                               
hope. Wind  energy costs over  $15,000 per kilowatt hour  just to                                                               
get the  equipment in.  It would  take 30 or  40 years  to recoup                                                               
that cost and none of the  corporations have the money to pay for                                                               
it up front.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
4:08:47 PM                                                                                                                    
CODY LARSON, representing himself,  Dillingham, Alaska opposed SB
32. He said  he was proud the  state and its history.  He said we                                                               
should  honor the  elected  officials who  had  the foresight  to                                                               
create a  solid management plan who  made the rules for  the park                                                               
to remain pristine and in  wilderness. If those rules don't allow                                                               
the feasibility  study, he opposed SB  31 as well as  Amendment 1                                                               
that  was  originally  denied  by   the  Division  of  Parks  and                                                               
Recreation.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
4:10:32 PM                                                                                                                    
BING SANTAMOUR, representing herself,  Bethel, Alaska, opposed SB
32, because of  how it would destroy her subsistence  way of life                                                               
that  she  has depended  on  forever  as  well  as those  of  her                                                               
children  and  grandchildren. She  would  rather  keep eating  of                                                               
nature's bounty than to have a  project put in that would destroy                                                               
the food  source that state  residents of  the area have  come to                                                               
depend on.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
4:13:18 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR  MICCICHE,  finding  no  further  comments,  closed  public                                                               
testimony and asked Mr. Ellis why the original study was denied.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
4:13:56 PM                                                                                                                    
BEN ELLIS,  Director, Division of  Parks and  Outdoor Recreation,                                                               
Department  of  Natural  Resources, Anchorage,  Alaska,  answered                                                               
that the  Wood-Tikchik State Park  is a  legislatively designated                                                               
area and  the legislature  sets out the  parameters for  what can                                                               
and cannot happen  within it. Chikuminuk Lake is  not listed with                                                               
Grant  and Elva  at the  present  time, so  that development  and                                                               
operation  of a  hydroelectric site  would be  incompatible under                                                               
the present  legislation. So the  part of the permits  that dealt                                                               
with  development of  a hydroelectric  project, such  as seismic,                                                               
were  denied where  other permits  which  dealt with  information                                                               
gathering of  a general nature,  animal movements,  stream gauges                                                               
and flow, and fish migration, were permitted.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR MICCICHE  asked if it would  be possible to do  the studies                                                               
without the higher impact activities.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MR. ELLIS answered that he  understood that Nuvista was no longer                                                               
using  motorized craft  on Chikuminuk  Lake, but  he didn't  know                                                               
about the other activities.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
4:15:50 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR BISHOP asked if helicopters are prohibited in the park.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
MR. ELLIS answered  that they could be permitted  under a special                                                               
use  permit  and that  the  flight  pattern  has to  be  approved                                                               
through the director's office.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
4:16:34 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR GIESSEL said she knew  she was expressing the feelings of                                                               
the entire  committee when  Mr. Robert Beans  shared that  he had                                                               
lost  his son  and extended  her condolences.  She then  moved to                                                               
report CSSB 32 (CRA), version  28-LS311\A.2 from committee to the                                                               
next committee  of referral  with individual  recommendations and                                                               
attached fiscal note(s). There were  no objections, and it was so                                                               
ordered.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
4:17:50 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR  MICCICHE  said  these are  difficult  decisions,  but  the                                                               
reality of  it is  there isn't  a source  of energy  that doesn't                                                               
have  a benefit  and some  impacts.  He struggled  with the  bill                                                               
originally, but with the amendment  it allows a feasibility study                                                               
to  determine if  further discussion  is even  warranted. If  the                                                               
studies  are   favorable,  it  begins  that   entire  process  of                                                               
proceeding cautiously and responsible through permitting.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
4:19:00 PM                                                                                                                    
There  being  no  further  business to  come  before  the  Senate                                                               
Community   and  Regional   Affairs  Committee,   Chair  Micciche                                                               
adjourned the meeting at 4:19 p.m.                                                                                              

Document Name Date/Time Subjects
SB 32 - Opposition email - Jonathan Friedman - 2-10-13.PDF SCRA 2/12/2013 3:30:00 PM
SB 32
SB 32 - Opposition email - Patti Berkhahn 2-9-13.PDF SCRA 2/12/2013 3:30:00 PM
SB 32
SB 32 - Dan Dunaway -additional information - Part 1.PDF SCRA 2/12/2013 3:30:00 PM
SB 32
Dan Dunaway -Attachment - Special Park Use Permit-LAS 28479 - Part 2.pdf SCRA 2/12/2013 3:30:00 PM
SB 32
Dan Dunaway - Attachment A Public Comments LAS 28479-Nuvista - Part 3.pdf SCRA 2/12/2013 3:30:00 PM
SB 32
SB 32 Amendment #1.PDF SCRA 2/12/2013 3:30:00 PM
SB 32
SB 32-Fiscal Note-2-2-13.pdf SCRA 2/12/2013 3:30:00 PM
SB 32
SB 32 - Opposition letter - Tim Troll 2-12-13.pdf SCRA 2/12/2013 3:30:00 PM
SB 32
SB 32 - Opposition Letter -Myron Angstman 2-12-13.pdf SCRA 2/12/2013 3:30:00 PM
SB 32